Post Reply 
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
08-26-2014, 02:31 AM
Post: #1
Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
I have played around 50 turns in several games with SCIF where I had an amazing contact rating. I note chance of spy event is non existent or extremely low without amazing rating (easy to demonstrate, temporarily move the scif ship). With stationary ship and amazing rating, it's pretty easy to get 15% or more percentage chance. So, in the 50 turns (guesstimated) in the various games, I got one spy event. Yes, I know I could build more spies, etc., and, 15% isn't the highest chance. But over 50 or so turns, 15% yielding one result? Virtually impossible if you do that math.

This happened in test games I played as well (not SO test, team test). So, I am curious as to if the issue could be..... the foreign screen reporting the correct event chance, BUT, the actual logic used when checking for an event neglected said contact bonus? This would be more in line with the achieved spy results. Or, I suppose it could be the foreign screen showing the wrong percent chance I suppose, but, it seems reasonable given I can lower it by simply moving the scif ship.

This one is hard to prove. However, it's clear at present it's a total waste of time and effort in the games I am playing.

GC ID: E45y Rid3r
Season 1 Saturn Division Champion
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-26-2014, 03:15 AM
Post: #2
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
(08-26-2014 02:31 AM)sfatula Wrote:  I have played around 50 turns in several games with SCIF where I had an amazing contact rating. I note chance of spy event is non existent or extremely low without amazing rating (easy to demonstrate, temporarily move the scif ship). With stationary ship and amazing rating, it's pretty easy to get 15% or more percentage chance. So, in the 50 turns (guesstimated) in the various games, I got one spy event. Yes, I know I could build more spies, etc., and, 15% isn't the highest chance. But over 50 or so turns, 15% yielding one result? Virtually impossible if you do that math.

This happened in test games I played as well (not SO test, team test). So, I am curious as to if the issue could be..... the foreign screen reporting the correct event chance, BUT, the actual logic used when checking for an event neglected said contact bonus? This would be more in line with the achieved spy results. Or, I suppose it could be the foreign screen showing the wrong percent chance I suppose, but, it seems reasonable given I can lower it by simply moving the scif ship.

This one is hard to prove. However, it's clear at present it's a total waste of time and effort in the games I am playing.

There are positive events that don't register, if I recall correctly. I forget the specifics. Something like you get a positive event doing something that doesn't apply (i.e., you slow down a fleet, but no fleet is in motion). It counts as a positive hit, but you get nothing out of it, and no report to let you know (i.e., your spies had an opportunity to slow a fleet, but none were moving, so the opportunity passed). Or assassinate a leader, but the opponent doesn't have one.

I've certainly had spying be very effective, both for gaining tech or resources, or by forcing the opponent to build up spies. And yes, without SCIF spying is very difficult to get into positive territory.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-26-2014, 03:29 AM
Post: #3
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
Ok, I can see how some of that could be true. However, not over 50 turns. There is plenty of tech to be had. I know the opponents in these games have way more tech. So, while it could be simply getting the wrong event, that many times? I suspect a SCIF bug myself. It just looks and feels that way.

GC ID: E45y Rid3r
Season 1 Saturn Division Champion
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-26-2014, 03:41 AM
Post: #4
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
(08-26-2014 03:29 AM)sfatula Wrote:  Ok, I can see how some of that could be true. However, not over 50 turns. There is plenty of tech to be had. I know the opponents in these games have way more tech. So, while it could be simply getting the wrong event, that many times? I suspect a SCIF bug myself. It just looks and feels that way.

Might be. If you want, we can start a test game, adv. empire, small galaxy, just to test. Take some research/brilliant builds so we can get tech up. Keep defensive spies to just a couple, build up offensive spies. Probably charismatic to make it cost less, but that is starting to be a goofy build. With no threat of invasion, though, should be extra resources to build up.

Just about every time I take a spying build, I feel that it isn't worth it. I don't seem to get tech that I want or need, and it seems like I don't get 1 hit out of 10 if I have a 10 percent chance. But I've never empirically tested it, either, using different scenarios. When I did ask, I got the response I gave you. Seems like if we could get it up to 25 or 33 percent, it wouldn't take that long to test.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-26-2014, 04:50 AM
Post: #5
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
Seems to be working well for VL in our FFA. My labs were his personally libraries.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-26-2014, 08:14 AM
Post: #6
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
(08-26-2014 04:50 AM)sfx51 Wrote:  Seems to be working well for VL in our FFA. My labs were his personally libraries.

Yup. I've had great success spying with SCIFs. I also build lots of spies when I do spying with scifs, so I have a lot higher than 30% chance to succeed. If anything, I would suspect a bug int he spying code causing it to go off less than expected, not a bug with SCIFs themselves.

But like Diebo said, there's a number of reasons you could "succeed" at a spy event but get no message due to there being nothing for the spy to do for that event. With a strict 50*.15 on spying, you should get ~7.5 spy events in 50 turns. Obviously, it doesn't work out that way, so you could get more, or you could get less. If you get a few less than the average, and a few failed successes, you could easily see 1 success in 50 turns.

GC ID - VanderLegion, GMT-9. Sandbox GC ID (Beta) - VanderLegion
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-27-2014, 02:36 AM
Post: #7
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
The current system seems a little off to me as well. I've had 60% spy rating with a planet within 5 parsecs and fuel 3 and it says no chance in hell underneath. Is spying even possible without the tech now? I have seen smuggler/spy build work to an extent but can't see it working against seasoned players.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-27-2014, 03:01 AM
Post: #8
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
(08-27-2014 02:36 AM)Usal Wrote:  The current system seems a little off to me as well. I've had 60% spy rating with a planet within 5 parsecs and fuel 3 and it says no chance in hell underneath. Is spying even possible without the tech now? I have seen smuggler/spy build work to an extent but can't see it working against seasoned players.

I've been able to spy without SCIF, but you need to be close, have high fuel tech, and have a lot of spies. It usually isn't worth it, except to disrupt an opponent that is putting 100 percent of their spies on you. Spying is secondary; redistributing opponent resources is primary.

That said, in team games, or in big FFA, there is room for spying. With 4+ other players, if you are dedicated to spying you can always find someone where you would have a decent chance at spying success.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
Post: #9
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
Still not working for me. Either the percent is wrong, or, I am incredibly lucky to get no event. The math just does not support one event.

GC ID: E45y Rid3r
Season 1 Saturn Division Champion
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
09-03-2014, 01:08 AM
Post: #10
RE: Suspect SCIF, spying bonus not working
Bottom line, SCIF is working for me on spying, and when I'm close to 100%, I'm getting something most turns. I'd say probably about 80-85% of turns. So if 15% is out the window, then perhaps that is what you are seeing?

Side question: any benefit to going over 100%?

1.09 Tournament Champion (February, 2012)
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)

Contact Us | Starbase Orion | Return to Top | Return to Content | Lite (Archive) Mode | RSS Syndication