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Starting tech
04-07-2012, 04:25 AM
Post: #1
Starting tech
I was going to post this in the 1.1.3 thread, then figured it should get it's own for discussion.

I was looking at the notes for 1.1.3 at the fact that things were being changed so that you started with Hydro 1 instead of RC1. I was originally thinking maybe a research focused race should start out with RC1 either instead of or in addition to Hydro 1, then had the thought, what if your starting tech was based on your racials instead of everyone starting with the same thing?

For example:
Industry - Efficient Factories 1
Research - Research Center 1
Farming - Hydro 1
Income - Trade Ports (previously might have said Efficient Tax Collection, but with it being changed to an empire wide tech, doesn't fit as well with the theme of starting with 1 building you can build starting out and having it on one planet)
Growth - Cloning Facilities (Might be too powerful early game? a baby boomer race that started with cloning would get some ridiculous population growth, especially with the ability to set planets to increase growth...)

It could be set up so if you have a single 6 point trait in one of the above categories, you get the tech associated with that trait. If you have multiple 6 point traits, you get to pick the tech associated with any one of them. If you don't have any 6 point traits, then you get to pick the tech for any one of the ones you have a 3 point trait for (maybe limited to a smaller subset, for instance if cloning were to be the tech for growth, maybe it's limited to 6 point only, 3 point doesn't work).

It could even be expanded out to some of the other traits in the race tree probably if desired, just was looking at it and the ones I listed above kind of make sense with the different racial traits

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04-07-2012, 04:41 AM
Post: #2
RE: Starting tech
The purpose of switching to hydroponics instead of RC was to balance production vs research races. By giving production races a free RC, it allowed them to snowball research too quickly.

Hydros are nice because everyone gets the same benefit from it; it frees up a couple colonists for all empires to put them on research or production as they wish.

I like where you are going with this, but I want to save this idea for an "advanced game start" option (i.e., where each side as a few systems, more tech unlocked, bigger fleets etc)
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04-07-2012, 04:44 AM
Post: #3
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 04:25 AM)VanderLegion Wrote:  I was going to post this in the 1.1.3 thread, then figured it should get it's own for discussion.

I was looking at the notes for 1.1.3 at the fact that things were being changed so that you started with Hydro 1 instead of RC1. I was originally thinking maybe a research focused race should start out with RC1 either instead of or in addition to Hydro 1, then had the thought, what if your starting tech was based on your racials instead of everyone starting with the same thing?

For example:
Industry - Efficient Factories 1
Research - Research Center 1
Farming - Hydro 1
Income - Trade Ports (previously might have said Efficient Tax Collection, but with it being changed to an empire wide tech, doesn't fit as well with the theme of starting with 1 building you can build starting out and having it on one planet)
Growth - Cloning Facilities (Might be too powerful early game? a baby boomer race that started with cloning would get some ridiculous population growth, especially with the ability to set planets to increase growth...)

It could be set up so if you have a single 6 point trait in one of the above categories, you get the tech associated with that trait. If you have multiple 6 point traits, you get to pick the tech associated with any one of them. If you don't have any 6 point traits, then you get to pick the tech for any one of the ones you have a 3 point trait for (maybe limited to a smaller subset, for instance if cloning were to be the tech for growth, maybe it's limited to 6 point only, 3 point doesn't work).

It could even be expanded out to some of the other traits in the race tree probably if desired, just was looking at it and the ones I listed above kind of make sense with the different racial traits

+1 This actually makes a heck of a lot of sense to me.

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Though we are not now that strength that in
Old days moved earth and heaven
That which we are, we are
One equal temper of heroic hearts
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield
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04-07-2012, 04:55 AM
Post: #4
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 04:41 AM)rocco Wrote:  The purpose of switching to hydroponics instead of RC was to balance production vs research races. By giving production races a free RC, it allowed them to snowball research too quickly.

Hydros are nice because everyone gets the same benefit from it; it frees up a couple colonists for all empires to put them on research or production as they wish.
Makes sense

Quote:I like where you are going with this, but I want to save this idea for an "advanced game start" option (i.e., where each side as a few systems, more tech unlocked, bigger fleets etc)

Works for me. Just kind of occurred to me, figured it'd be a good thing to post and get feedback on. Would also be good later on if other types of victory are added - would serve to differentiate races focusing on different victory conditions more.

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04-07-2012, 05:35 AM
Post: #5
RE: Starting tech
And different map sizes having different conditions. Small map and squire all techs would be a lot harder (I think...) maybe have an amount of RP spent limit instead of collecting ... Techs. Otherwise they could work for all of the cheaper level one techs and ignore the big things like titans and high level weapons.

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04-07-2012, 05:38 AM
Post: #6
RE: Starting tech
I really like the change to hydroponics as starting tech. Will try out a build without plant whisperer now... Could be viableSmile

As for different starting techs depending on race. It would be cool with right balance.... I think industrious already have upper hand so giving them advance factory early on would enable them to really spam out colonies...
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04-07-2012, 05:41 AM
Post: #7
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 05:38 AM)General_Grr Wrote:  I really like the change to hydroponics as starting tech. Will try out a build without plant whisperer now... Could be viableSmile

It's already viable. I haven't played with a food bonus since 1.1.0 bumped up the food income. I'm actually experimenting with using the -1/2 food per farmer at the moment to get more racial points. So far, it hasn't done too bad, when you only have 5 farmers starting out, it's not too bad of a penalty.

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04-07-2012, 05:44 AM
Post: #8
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 04:25 AM)VanderLegion Wrote:  I was going to post this in the 1.1.3 thread, then figured it should get it's own for discussion.

I was looking at the notes for 1.1.3 at the fact that things were being changed so that you started with Hydro 1 instead of RC1. I was originally thinking maybe a research focused race should start out with RC1 either instead of or in addition to Hydro 1, then had the thought, what if your starting tech was based on your racials instead of everyone starting with the same thing?

For example:
Industry - Efficient Factories 1
Research - Research Center 1
Farming - Hydro 1
Income - Trade Ports (previously might have said Efficient Tax Collection, but with it being changed to an empire wide tech, doesn't fit as well with the theme of starting with 1 building you can build starting out and having it on one planet)
Growth - Cloning Facilities (Might be too powerful early game? a baby boomer race that started with cloning would get some ridiculous population growth, especially with the ability to set planets to increase growth...)

It could be set up so if you have a single 6 point trait in one of the above categories, you get the tech associated with that trait. If you have multiple 6 point traits, you get to pick the tech associated with any one of them. If you don't have any 6 point traits, then you get to pick the tech for any one of the ones you have a 3 point trait for (maybe limited to a smaller subset, for instance if cloning were to be the tech for growth, maybe it's limited to 6 point only, 3 point doesn't work).

It could even be expanded out to some of the other traits in the race tree probably if desired, just was looking at it and the ones I listed above kind of make sense with the different racial traits

This made me have a thought as well. What if your tech tree changed based on your racial traits. For example,

Industry - Techs you can research are heavily production based
Research - Wide variety available
Farming - Techs you can research are heavily farming based
Income - Techs are based on producing income

All races would see the whole tech tree, it would just look differently to each race type.

*****
Though we are not now that strength that in
Old days moved earth and heaven
That which we are, we are
One equal temper of heroic hearts
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield
-------
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04-07-2012, 06:07 AM
Post: #9
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 05:44 AM)StandAlone Wrote:  
(04-07-2012 04:25 AM)VanderLegion Wrote:  I was going to post this in the 1.1.3 thread, then figured it should get it's own for discussion.

I was looking at the notes for 1.1.3 at the fact that things were being changed so that you started with Hydro 1 instead of RC1. I was originally thinking maybe a research focused race should start out with RC1 either instead of or in addition to Hydro 1, then had the thought, what if your starting tech was based on your racials instead of everyone starting with the same thing?

For example:
Industry - Efficient Factories 1
Research - Research Center 1
Farming - Hydro 1
Income - Trade Ports (previously might have said Efficient Tax Collection, but with it being changed to an empire wide tech, doesn't fit as well with the theme of starting with 1 building you can build starting out and having it on one planet)
Growth - Cloning Facilities (Might be too powerful early game? a baby boomer race that started with cloning would get some ridiculous population growth, especially with the ability to set planets to increase growth...)

It could be set up so if you have a single 6 point trait in one of the above categories, you get the tech associated with that trait. If you have multiple 6 point traits, you get to pick the tech associated with any one of them. If you don't have any 6 point traits, then you get to pick the tech for any one of the ones you have a 3 point trait for (maybe limited to a smaller subset, for instance if cloning were to be the tech for growth, maybe it's limited to 6 point only, 3 point doesn't work).

It could even be expanded out to some of the other traits in the race tree probably if desired, just was looking at it and the ones I listed above kind of make sense with the different racial traits

This made me have a thought as well. What if your tech tree changed based on your racial traits. For example,

Industry - Techs you can research are heavily production based
Research - Wide variety available
Farming - Techs you can research are heavily farming based
Income - Techs are based on producing income

All races would see the whole tech tree, it would just look differently to each race type.

That could be interesting as well, techs move up or down in the tech tree depending on your racial traits.

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04-07-2012, 08:50 AM
Post: #10
RE: Starting tech
(04-07-2012 05:41 AM)VanderLegion Wrote:  
(04-07-2012 05:38 AM)General_Grr Wrote:  I really like the change to hydroponics as starting tech. Will try out a build without plant whisperer now... Could be viableSmile

It's already viable. I haven't played with a food bonus since 1.1.0 bumped up the food income. I'm actually experimenting with using the -1/2 food per farmer at the moment to get more racial points. So far, it hasn't done too bad, when you only have 5 farmers starting out, it's not too bad of a penalty.

So I just realized that this isn't entirely accurate. I've been using Shared Intel for a long time now for the industry boost, and remembered that it has the side effect of boosting my food production on my homeworld by 1 per farmer starting out as well...

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